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CANADIAN DOLLAR FORECAST VIDEO



 
 
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  #11  
Old July 27th 06, 01:01 AM posted to misc.invest.futures
truth-b-told
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,368
Default CANADIAN DOLLAR FORECAST VIDEO

Excellent post Gerillio. Here is another one!!

http://www.quatloos.com/Tax-Forums/v....php?t=1005580

Enjoy.

Sincerely,
gerillio.

########
########
Are those who sell MLM programs criminals or stupid victims?


Quatloos! Forum Index MLM Scams Forum (as if any of them

aren't)
View previous topic :: View next topic

Are those who sell MLM programs criminals or stupid victims
Criminals
42% [ 3 ]
Stupid Victims
57% [ 4 ]

Total Votes : 7


Author Message
Joey Smith
Infidel Enslaver


Joined: 13 Jan 2003
Posts: 4151

Posted: Mon Jul 24, 2006 2:02 pm Post subject: Are those who sell
MLM programs criminals or stupid victims?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Explain your answer.

This is referring to those below the organizers in the scheme of
things, i.e., those who buy into MLM programs thinking that they will
grow large downlines and become immensely wealthy.

My answer: Criminals. The fact that they may also be victims does not
negate the fact that they are out trying to scam their family and
friends into buying into a worthless biz. opp. or buying crates of
overpriced and often worthless products.
_________________
- - - - - - - - - - -
"The real George Washington was shot dead fairly early in the
Revolution." ~ David Merrill, 9-17-2004 --- "This is where I belong" ~
Heidi Guedel, 7-1-2006 (referring to suijuris.net)
- - - - - - - - - - -

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Demosthenes
Grand Exalted Keeper of Esoterica


Joined: 29 Jan 2003
Posts: 7938

Posted: Mon Jul 24, 2006 2:08 pm Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I'll go with victims. I don't see a lot of sinister intent; just a
gullible mindset.
_________________
"Guns don't kill people. The government does."
-- Dale Gribble

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Elmware
Blessed Ancient of the Sixth Qu Dynasty


Joined: 07 Feb 2003
Posts: 101
Location: Earth
Posted: Mon Jul 24, 2006 4:37 pm Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I'd say it depends where you stand in the pyramid and what your
knowledge is.

If you know it's a scam and you're still recuiting people, then yes you
are a criminal.
_________________


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wserra
Quatloosian Federal Witness


Joined: 26 Apr 2003
Posts: 1419

Posted: Mon Jul 24, 2006 5:06 pm Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Like lots of other contexts, there are all sorts of shades of gray.

I only know a couple of people who have gotten involved with MLMs
personally. One of those - a former secretary of mine - really does
bust her butt trying to sell Mary Kay, and has not made a thing. She
may be in the process of catching on by now. In any event, she is no
criminal.

That said, the marks' greed is a major element in the success of Boss
Scammers generally. It takes a certain degree of willful blindness (to
borrow a phrase from the criminal context) to buy into most of this
stuff. But the people at the top creating the hype are still the real
culprits.

More "victim" than "criminal". Joey, you would be one hangin' judge.

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buck09
Quatloosian Baron of the Unknown Statute


Joined: 29 Apr 2003
Posts: 489
Location: They locked us in the basement of the IRS building in DC. We
get a meal for every 5 posts.
Posted: Mon Jul 24, 2006 6:58 pm Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

wserra wrote:
That said, the marks' greed is a major element in the success of Boss
Scammers generally. It takes a certain degree of willful blindness (to
borrow a phrase from the criminal context) to buy into most of this
stuff. But the people at the top creating the hype are still the real
culprits.


I would tend to agree with you. I'm a firm believer in the "everyone
has a blind spot" point of view. The recovery time may vary from person
to person - i.e. the 99% 5 year drop out rate vs the 2% that sticks to
it.. I think at some point has gotten scammed, it just seems that MLM
has crafted the art of grifting to reach a very large set of marks...

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PonziKiller
Captain



Joined: 18 Feb 2006
Posts: 172

Posted: Mon Jul 24, 2006 7:24 pm Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Demosthenes wrote:
I'll go with victims. I don't see a lot of sinister intent; just a
gullible mindset.


The leaders and the so called big dogs, the big recruiters everyone
sign up under, are criminals.

Those who sign up last in a pyramid are just gullible victims.

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robert wright
Scalawag



Joined: 19 Jun 2006
Posts: 65

Posted: Tue Jul 25, 2006 12:14 pm Post subject: neither,both

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I say neither and both. I think this depends on a few things.

1. Some MLMers join companies because they, for some reason, like the
product and think that others will. They buy the opportunity thinking
they can make some money or save money by joining (because they like
and use the product). Usually they will lose money. This person is
stupid but neither victim nor criminal.

2. Some MLMers never do their homework. They get the pitch, get excited
and jump in. Had they really looked at the compensation plan, they
would notice that sales of products don't really make enough money to
cover the cost (unless you sold a lot of product) of the program.
However, recruiting does. Then, they find out that noone wants to pay
$300-$1000 to join also. These people are naive. These people in my
opinion are neither.

Other than that, I say most start as victims and end as criminals.
_________________
Why should I pay you to sell your products????

Rob Wright

www.comdetroit.com
www.comdetroit.net

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simmysam
Cannoneer



Joined: 18 Aug 2005
Posts: 90

Posted: Wed Jul 26, 2006 7:30 pm Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Joey Smith wrote:
Quote:
My answer: Criminals. The fact that they may also be victims does not
negate the fact that they are out trying to scam their family and
friends into buying into a worthless biz. opp. or buying crates of
overpriced and often worthless products.

Thats a little harsh don't you think? If they truly buy into the
program and don't know any better, then I don't think it's fair to
imply they're trying to scam their family and friends.

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Shakespearegirl
Captain



Joined: 30 Nov 2005
Posts: 151

Posted: Wed Jul 26, 2006 9:31 pm Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

This is pretty funny.

Since I once bought into Mary Kay (and lasted less than 6 months), I
can say that I *wish* I was not a criminal, and instead was just a
victim.....but....I can say that my personality started to change when
I had to start viewing every person I came into contact with as a
"mark". That's when I started to get a scuzzy feeling and decided that
Mary Kay wasn't a good idea.

Now - at the time I just thought that that feeling meant I wasn't a
good "salesperson". I thought that all sales would require the kind of
behavior I was being trained in, so I didn't relize that I was part of
a huge MLM scam.

At the time I also wasn't clear about what MLM was - Mary Kay reps tell
all of their new recruits that MK IS NOT MLM. It was only after getting
out and doing a little internet searching that I figured out what was
going on...

SO, I'm not actually a stupid person, however I was uninformed and
rather gullible when I fell for the pitch.

But the women who stay in Mary Kay and keeping trying to reach the top
of the pyramid are outright criminals, in my opinion, because they
*know* what goes on behind the scenes and they continue to hurt people.


(wserra - your secretary is in MK? Too bad - she'll figure it out soon
if she's somewhat intelligent...)
_________________
Exposing Mary Kay
http://pinkcadillac.typepad.com

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truth-b-told wrote:
Hey RAT Ratchford,

Read this:

http://www.quatloos.com/Tax-Forums/v...e3e b32e86b38


Posted: Sun Jul 16, 2006 2:20 am Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Jkramos.... thanks for sharing your story. You joined 4E based on what
you beleived to be facts. As it turns out, the so-called facts were
basically all lies.

Its too bad, because most good people like yourself assumed that
Enrique et al were honorable men. Enrique in particular spoke of how
everything he does is related to ethics. That was a lie, too.

I am amazed that 4E has anyone left.

Back to top


fuelsaving
Stowaway



Joined: 06 May 2006
Posts: 8

Posted: Sun Jul 16, 2006 9:43 am Post subject: HERE IS THE
TRUTH ABOUT ENRIQUE, ETHOS AND 4-E

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

jkramos wrote:
...
a load of stuff
....

Wow - if even half of that is true then it's bad news for Ethos.

I think that Enrique probably really did go to China, but only to sign
up a local distributor. No sign of any awards or meetings with senior
Government officials.

I have to agree with wserra, thought, that the statement "D-1280X
works" is highly debatable. The Camp Pendleton tests were under
uncontrolled conditions, with many other variable factors; the only
scientific testing of D-1280X, by CARB, showed no improvement in fuel
consumption. To my mind, Ethos FR and D-1280X are equally useless.

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kaycee
Gunner's Mate



Joined: 13 Mar 2006
Posts: 40

Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2006 4:20 pm Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

When the CA, AG shuts them down, what kind of Federal crimes will
Enrique be indicted for? I assume stealing 400 grand from an investor
is a crime of somesorts, not to mention all false pretenses to lure the
many other smaller investors?

If Enrique beats it back to Mexico before being arrested, what are the
chances he can be extradited, given the corrupt state of the mexican
government?

Back to top


PonziKiller
Captain



Joined: 18 Feb 2006
Posts: 172

Posted: Tue Jul 18, 2006 3:00 pm Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

JohnnyB wrote:
Jkramos.... thanks for sharing your story. You joined 4E based on what
you beleived to be facts. As it turns out, the so-called facts were
basically all lies.

Its too bad, because most good people like yourself assumed that
Enrique et al were honorable men. Enrique in particular spoke of how
everything he does is related to ethics. That was a lie, too.

I am amazed that 4E has anyone left.


I am agreed with you to some point.
I have just BIG problems to believe that people with their senses in
order, join companies like Ethos, 4Ecorp, Bioperformance or other
similar scam sites.

When you do a check on Google, any "Whois", and a check on the
site's claims or other places in advance of a "membership", no
one would possible get scammed.

In the other hand I know that the so called networkers recruit among
people who are in a desperate need of money or an extra income. They
usually don't take the time to check anything, they believe in what
their "sponsor" say (lies).

No one have ever succeded in order to recruit me in any pyramid, mlm or
ponzi. Many pyramidiots have tryed to do so the last 30 years. All of
them are economical losers to day...


Sincerely,
gerillio.

##########
##########


  #12  
Old July 27th 06, 01:08 AM posted to misc.invest.futures
truth-b-told
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,368
Default CANADIAN DOLLAR FORECAST VIDEO

Here's Enrique Ratchford.....

#######
#######

Posted: Thu Jul 13, 2006 2:45 pm Post subject: Ethos drops "save 7
-19%" claim

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

If you go to http://www.4-ecorp.com/products.php you will find the old
"Hundreds of millions of miles of road tests has proven that commercial
fleets on average increase fuel mileage between 7% and 19% and reduce
emissions" has gone. The figures have also disappeared from 4-E's other
pages, so far as I can tell, to be replaced by a vague "saves fuel"
claim. Is this claim going to turn out to be Ethos Lie #17 ?

Perhaps it's time to promote my own technical commentary on Ethos
again: http://www.fuelsaving.info/ethos.htm

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JohnnyB
Pirate's Mate



Joined: 04 Jun 2006
Posts: 111

Posted: Thu Jul 13, 2006 3:21 pm Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Very funny. Add this to the long list of 4E lies, unproven claims and
exaggerations.

If there was a single claim that the brainwashed 4E reps could always
hang their hat on was that Ethos saved 7 to 19% on fuel.

Now it seems that even this claim has evaporated.

Writing is on the wall and I suspect that 4E may soon evaporate.



Back to top


Joey Smith
Infidel Enslaver


Joined: 13 Jan 2003
Posts: 4151

Posted: Fri Jul 14, 2006 12:42 pm Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Uh, why would anybody buy it now?

Are the bottles pretty?
_________________
- - - - - - - - - - -
"The real George Washington was shot dead fairly early in the
Revolution." ~ David Merrill, 9-17-2004 --- "This is where I belong" ~
Heidi Guedel, 7-1-2006 (referring to suijuris.net)
- - - - - - - - - - -



######
######

Sincerely,
gerillio.....aka Truth-b-Told.

  #13  
Old July 27th 06, 04:19 AM posted to misc.invest.futures
ProfitMaxTrading.com
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 147
Default CANADIAN DOLLAR FORECAST VIDEO

I've read this and a couple others from individuals, not much different than
you, that have an agenda and are more interested in spreading lies. There is
even a website that exposes these people, such as Phil Piccolo, as outright
liars with an agenda to steal people away from 4-E to their own MLM.

Fact is, their checks are not bouncing. How do I know? Because I have been
cashing a whole bunch of those checks that come in my mailbox every couple
of weeks. Not a single one has ever bounced.

Also, it is a fact that these people lie about the product as well. How do I
know? Other than the fact that I did 16 complete gas tank top offs during a
cross state trip I took last month and noted a substantial increase in mpg,
but to demonstrate for myself whether the product worked in a controlled
situation, I did the following test:

Using a lawn mower, I taped the handle to keep the motor running without the
blade engaging.

Then, using a measured glass, I placed 3 ounces of untreated gas into the
bone dry mower and allowed it to run till it was dry again. I did this three
times, with each time the mower died just after 7 minutes, never going more
than 7 min 40 sec. The average baseline was 7 min 29 sec.

Then I tested with fuel treated with EthosFR. Every run exceeded 8 minutes,
averaging 8 min 28 sec after 4 tests.

The result? Conclusive! 13% improvement in running time.

So while you can further spread the lies made by those simply trying to
steal distributors for their own MLM, the smart ones are not so gullible to
believe all that garbage and are saving a ton of money on their gas bills,
and making a lot of money in commissions.

And those are the facts.

-R

PS: What this has to do with the Canadian Dollar is beyond me. But then,
you're not much for discussing trades on a trading forum anyway. So no
surprise there.





"truth-b-told" wrote in message
oups.com...
Hey RAT Ratchford,

Read this:

http://www.quatloos.com/Tax-Forums/v...e3e b32e86b38


Posted: Sun Jul 16, 2006 2:20 am Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Jkramos.... thanks for sharing your story. You joined 4E based on what
you beleived to be facts. As it turns out, the so-called facts were
basically all lies.

Its too bad, because most good people like yourself assumed that
Enrique et al were honorable men. Enrique in particular spoke of how
everything he does is related to ethics. That was a lie, too.

I am amazed that 4E has anyone left.

Back to top


fuelsaving
Stowaway



Joined: 06 May 2006
Posts: 8

Posted: Sun Jul 16, 2006 9:43 am Post subject: HERE IS THE
TRUTH ABOUT ENRIQUE, ETHOS AND 4-E

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

jkramos wrote:
...
a load of stuff
....

Wow - if even half of that is true then it's bad news for Ethos.

I think that Enrique probably really did go to China, but only to sign
up a local distributor. No sign of any awards or meetings with senior
Government officials.

I have to agree with wserra, thought, that the statement "D-1280X
works" is highly debatable. The Camp Pendleton tests were under
uncontrolled conditions, with many other variable factors; the only
scientific testing of D-1280X, by CARB, showed no improvement in fuel
consumption. To my mind, Ethos FR and D-1280X are equally useless.

Back to top


kaycee
Gunner's Mate



Joined: 13 Mar 2006
Posts: 40

Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2006 4:20 pm Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

When the CA, AG shuts them down, what kind of Federal crimes will
Enrique be indicted for? I assume stealing 400 grand from an investor
is a crime of somesorts, not to mention all false pretenses to lure the
many other smaller investors?

If Enrique beats it back to Mexico before being arrested, what are the
chances he can be extradited, given the corrupt state of the mexican
government?

Back to top


PonziKiller
Captain



Joined: 18 Feb 2006
Posts: 172

Posted: Tue Jul 18, 2006 3:00 pm Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

JohnnyB wrote:
Jkramos.... thanks for sharing your story. You joined 4E based on what
you beleived to be facts. As it turns out, the so-called facts were
basically all lies.

Its too bad, because most good people like yourself assumed that
Enrique et al were honorable men. Enrique in particular spoke of how
everything he does is related to ethics. That was a lie, too.

I am amazed that 4E has anyone left.


I am agreed with you to some point.
I have just BIG problems to believe that people with their senses in
order, join companies like Ethos, 4Ecorp, Bioperformance or other
similar scam sites.

When you do a check on Google, any "Whois", and a check on the
site's claims or other places in advance of a "membership", no
one would possible get scammed.

In the other hand I know that the so called networkers recruit among
people who are in a desperate need of money or an extra income. They
usually don't take the time to check anything, they believe in what
their "sponsor" say (lies).

No one have ever succeded in order to recruit me in any pyramid, mlm or
ponzi. Many pyramidiots have tryed to do so the last 30 years. All of
them are economical losers to day...


Sincerely,
gerillio.

##########
##########



  #14  
Old July 27th 06, 05:56 AM posted to misc.invest.futures
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 115
Default CANADIAN DOLLAR FORECAST VIDEO

RATCHFORD:
What this has to do with the Canadian Dollar is beyond me. But then,
you're not much for discussing trades on a trading forum anyway. So no
surprise there.

** You are so totally dishonest. You have taken every single
opportunity ... including this very message ... to promote you MLM crap
on this newsgroup.

  #15  
Old July 27th 06, 08:06 AM posted to misc.invest.futures
ProfitMaxTrading.com
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 147
Default CANADIAN DOLLAR FORECAST VIDEO

Replying to your messages about an MLM has nothing to do with honesty. It
has something to do with taking advantage of your wasting our time. If you
are going to do that, then we might as well erk you a bit by taking
advantage of your mentioning it.

For example: Dishonest? About what? A fuel reformulator that NBC and FOX
news has reported to actually work? And where might someone find out about
this? Why, right here ---- http://www.4-ecorp.com/fdates Hmmm. Save 30-60
cents a gallon or more and extend the life of my car or truck? Earn a
percentage from the big demand.

So blopper. Keep bringing this up and it will be my pleasure to plug away at
your expense.

You never seem to learn.

Change your evil ways and start talking about trading. Or remain a chump.
It's your loss.

-R



wrote in message
oups.com...
RATCHFORD:
What this has to do with the Canadian Dollar is beyond me. But then,
you're not much for discussing trades on a trading forum anyway. So no
surprise there.

** You are so totally dishonest. You have taken every single
opportunity ... including this very message ... to promote you MLM crap
on this newsgroup.



  #16  
Old July 27th 06, 03:40 PM posted to misc.invest.futures
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 115
Default CANADIAN DOLLAR FORECAST VIDEO

RATCHFORD:
Replying to your messages about an MLM has nothing to do with honesty.
It has something to do with taking advantage of your wasting our time.
If you are going to do that, then we might as well erk you a bit by
taking advantage of your mentioning it.

** What a ****ing asshole you are. I didn't think you could actually
be as dumb as Legan, but you are. And it's "irk," moron.

RATCHFORD:
Dishonest? About what? A fuel reformulator ... [rest of advertising
bull**** snipped]

** I wasn't talking about a stupid reformulation of some crap, I was
talking about the fact that YOU, of all people, chastised someone for
talking about non-trading matters. You are THE consummate hypocrite.

RATCHFORD:
You never seem to learn.

** Someone recently wondered why it is that only you (and Legan)
regularly get attacked for being vendors. If they didn't know before
(which seems hard to believe), they do now. You have an untarnished
record going back more than 10 years of lying, deceiving, spinning and
simply bull****ting. If you would just present your worthless results
and shut your mouth, you would see an immediate difference, but your
ego and insatiable need to be thought of as a "trading guru" overcome
even a thimbleful of common sense. I would be amazed if any more then
the few of us who waste our time by calling you on all your **** even
read any of your posts anymore.

RATCHFORD:
Change your evil ways and start talking about trading. Or remain a
chump. It's your loss.

** MY loss ... for not listening to your worthless drivel. If you are
going to reformulate anything, you should start with your meds!

  #17  
Old July 27th 06, 03:45 PM posted to misc.invest.futures
ProfitMaxTrading.com
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 147
Default CANADIAN DOLLAR FORECAST VIDEO

This one comment alone from you is enough for any honest hearted person to
see what type of person you are.

What follows after having made such a horrible comment is not even worth
considering.

I pity you.

-R



wrote in message
oups.com...
** What a ****ing asshole you are. I didn't think you could actually
be as dumb as Legan, but you are. And it's "irk," moron.



  #18  
Old July 27th 06, 04:01 PM posted to misc.invest.futures
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 115
Default CANADIAN DOLLAR FORECAST VIDEO

RATCHFORD:
This one comment alone from you is enough for any honest hearted person
to see what type of person you are. What follows after having made such
a horrible comment is not even worth considering. I pity you.

** So you think that 10 years of lying, misdirecting and spinning
everything under the sun gives you the right to take the high road?
What a total hypocrite you are.

  #19  
Old July 27th 06, 04:54 PM posted to misc.invest.futures
ProfitMaxTrading.com
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 147
Default off topic

" ** So you think that 10 years of lying, misdirecting and spinning
everything under the sun gives you the right to take the high road?
What a total hypocrite you are."


No. Not at all.

But that isn't who I am. It is what you have chosen to label me. If it
describes anyone, it is closer to who you are.

The facts are right there for anyone.

YOU:

1. Do not post ANY trading related posts on what is clearly a trading
newsgroup.
2. You ONLY write messages to attack someone.
3. You mis-direct, mislead and spin while suggesting that is what others are
doing. (Case in point: Even after I've made it clear on numerous responses
to your abusive messages that I do in fact trade, you continue to post that
I claimed not to. That's outright misrepresentation, deception, lying and
spinning.)

4. You have stated that you aren't much of a trader or one at all. Yet you
consider yourself in a position to judge someone who has been trading for
over 16 years.


ME:

1. My messages are trading related when not having to respond to a false
statement from someone like you.
2. My trading related messages are usually forecasts made in advance of
market action.
3. My forecasts have proven, year after year, to be highly accurate.
4. More than willing to help anyone who is looking for help.
5. Been trading for over 16 years.
6. Been operating a trading membership for 10 years.
7. Helped thousands of traders from all around the world for 10 years to
trade better.
8. Have demonstrated extreme confidence in calls made, boldly posting them
in the public eye for 10 years.
9. Continue to operate a very successful trading membership with an
extremely high retention rate of members in the face of business environment
that is obviously very competitive and at times abusive (from a few who are
not or never have been customers like you with dogmatic views and an agenda
for flaming).


Not only have my forecasts and market calls been posted in advance of market
action for 10 years now, but this year I have done several forecasts in
VIDEO, explaning step-by-step what I see and expect. We're not talking some
timid squeak here. We're talking about putting it all out there week after
week after week.

So you can call me whatever you like, but its just the opinion and words of
a fool who doesn't care about truth or anyone else but himself. You are a
person who doesn't care about anyone. But instead of giving, you take.
Instead of helping, you hurt. Instead of contributing to this newsgroup, you
flame and attack.

You are thus nothing more than an annoying pimple on an elephant's rear end.
So if the little pimple wants to call the elephant a rhino, it's still an
elephant.

-R





wrote in message
oups.com...
RATCHFORD:
This one comment alone from you is enough for any honest hearted person
to see what type of person you are. What follows after having made such
a horrible comment is not even worth considering. I pity you.

** So you think that 10 years of lying, misdirecting and spinning
everything under the sun gives you the right to take the high road?
What a total hypocrite you are.



  #20  
Old July 27th 06, 05:00 PM posted to misc.invest.futures
UMT
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 459
Default off topic

RatFord writes:

"My forecasts have proven, year after year, to be highly accurate"

Really? Says who?

Here's the problem, you've been asked time and time again to come up
with some sort of record of your 'forecasts',,,, real or
hypothetical,,,,, and you can't and won't do it? I know from following
your posts that your 'accuracy rate' is way less than 50%. On top of
that, your 'trading method' allows for ALOT of missed entries...

Now, you'll scream that this isn't correct. You have this entire forum
to PROVE me wrong.

New Traders Beware! Don't hold your breath for any 'proof' from
Ratford as it doesn't exist!

And remember:

"REAL TRADERS Don't Vend ! (They don't do MLM either!)

UMT

 




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